Life in Group 5 – A Resto Shaman Blog
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Philosophy

September 16, 2011

Too Soon: The Issue with Early Nerfs

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Written by: Vixsin
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It is a topic guaranteed to bring players out in droves, some angry and scrambling to their keyboards to start fighting the good fight, and others simply just to witness the spectacle that’s created with two mere words: content … nerfs. I’m generally not one to weigh in on Blizzard’s nerf decisions because, firstly, they rarely affect me, but secondarily because I understand the position of wanting to see content that was previously inaccessible to me. But, this past Monday, when Blizzard announced their intent to nerf not only normal mode Firelands, but some of the heroic modes as well, I admit I found my feathers a little bit ruffled. And, as I’m coming to find out, I’m not the only one.

Today, I want to do something that I don’t often do at LiG5—I’m going to turn over the reins and put the neutral standpoint I try to cultivate on hold, and share with you a post written by someone almost as verbose as myself. (No, not Derevka, who *ahem* has an open invitation to guest post here.) I admit, the following post, which went up on WoW’s R&D forums on Tuesday, may ruffle some feathers out there and it may make others see red, but I think there are some amazing points to be made (some of which I echoed in two posts last year—The Argument for Elitism: Part I and The Argument for Elitism: Part II). So with that, I’m handing the mic to Ashunei, the Guild Leader of Pie Chart (who is now obligated to have my Resto Shaman in for all future end boss kills, nerfed content or not).

(To comment on the post on WoW’s R&D forums, click here)

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(I’m not going to get caught up in rhetoric or nostalgia here. I will simply outline the largest issue with the nerfs that keep being rolled out for the remainder or end-game raiding content.)

Raiding has always been about the following things:

  • To continue the traditional form of gaming in fighting NPC bosses and mobs.
  • To fight these mobs at a much more “extraordinary” difficulty, that is to say, you cannot fight them alone.
  • To give purpose to the MMO genre, by giving people the ability to play with one another for a greater goal.
  • To provide a mechanism through which people will come together, cooperate, collaborate, and create community.
  • •To give players who engage in this content the ability to continue playing after they have finished leveling.

There are, however, aspects of raiding that exist as co-factors for the creation and maintenance of successful raiding content. In the same way that co-factors allow your body to continue with its many reactions and processes that keep your body alive and functioning, these co-factors for raiding result in more or less the same phenomenon. When these co-factors are not met or are met with diminished effort, the raiding game itself depletes and deteriorates.

  • The content is accessible and reasonably challenging for the players who are attempting it.
  • Logistically, it is possible to maintain the raid group that you are attempting this content with.
  • The content itself provides enough fun and challenge that it is attractive to the players.
  • The content isn’t overly frustrating or discouraging for the players that are engaging in it.
  • Completion of the challenging content gives the players rewards and awards for their efforts. Many could argue that this is part of the first list.
  • The meta-game is a reliable system, allowing for players to comfortably expect and attempt it. If the raid sizes were to change each tier, if the difficulties were out of whack, etc. then players would be dissuaded from staying consistent.

Now, here’s the problem that I can sympathize with, for Blizzard. When Vanilla WoW launched, the players who engaged in the raiding game had for the most part either taken part in raid content before (i.e. played other MMO’s like EQ) or were completely new to the game and were still enthralled by the various things the game had to offer. As time went on, more and more players began to reach that level of the game and started to increase the demand for raid content.

I can understand this, I can sympathize with the conundrum this ultimately brings about. As a provider, as a developer, your goal is to make as many players happy as possible. It’s also to bring about as much content as you possibly can for the players, aiming to satisfy their goals, by giving them fun and interesting content.

The Meta-Game

There are issues, however, that arise out of the raiding meta-game, once it has been created as a system. First of all, there is the existence of various skill levels and goals. Players who commit themselves more to the system are going to do better, they’re going to try harder, than those who aren’t as invested or motivated. But it is bad customer service and game design to punish people who fall into the latter category. I believe, and this is the point of this post, that it is just as bad for customer service, game design, and specifically raiding meta-game maintenance, to punish the players who fall into the first category.

And that is what these inconsistent, untimely nerfs do. They punish the players who are critical in powering the engine of raiding. You have thousands upon thousands of players who want to do this content, but if you remove the competitive spirit, if you destroy the mechanism of raiding at the top tier, you will inevitably slow down and eventually halt the raiding scheme as a whole.

The simple reason is because by doing all of this, you move away from the single most important thing that a video game has always had to offer, that any game for that matter, has ever had to offer:

Competitive challenge–people play games to stimulate their senses, to achieve a rewarding sense of satisfaction.

If the goal isn’t difficult to achieve, then it stands to reason that the endorphin releasing, stimulatory sense of celebration is also diminished and inevitably, people will always be driven to find the greatest means of satisfaction. And if raiding ceases to provide this for people, then it also stands to reason that they will begin to turn away from this source of content.

Now I know that lots of players since Burning Crusade have flocked to whatever area of the game has provided the best gear for the easiest time investment. I doubt that you’re catering to them by nerfing current tiers of content. I’m sure that you cater to them by providing badge content, which is the most accessible form of gearing up a character these days.

But the raiding metagame is driven by the fact that you get to two major things:

  • You get to attempt the hardest content in the game, in a raid setting which naturally means you get to play with a group of friends.
  • You get rewards that are the hardest to attain, that set you apart and above the people around you in game.

Vanity isn’t something you want to cater to, but it is always going to be a driving mechanism. But vanity isn’t worth arguing about, because for the most part, it has been watered down in this game anyway. These days you can’t easily tell the difference from a person who has done badge content and the person who has raided substantially. You can get the same mount from Heroic Ragnaros by simply doing normal Ragnaros, if you’re lucky enough. Heroic gear at best, gives you stats and a little green Heroic tag. So vanity, as a driving mechanism, for the most part has been diminished.

But these nerfs do something more dangerous for your raiding meta-game. They discourage and dissuade the people they affect most negatively and most directly, from continuing to pursue raiding. The entire purpose of the Heroic tier of raiding was to allow for players to all witness content, but to do so at their own paces. The entire point of Heroics were to provide all players with the ABILITY to attempt the hardest content, the most challenging and most rewarding content while also maintaining the ACCESSIBILITY for all players to see the content of the game, regardless.

By nerfing Heroics, especially inconsistently, long before the next tier of content is even due to be released (November is the best guess at this point given Old Republic, Blizzcon, and 4.3 Beta testing, as well as 5.0), you are catering to the part of the population that is either only willing to do Heroics to get gear or isn’t willing to try hard or creatively enough to actually surmount the encounters therein.

This was never supposed to be the point, but even if you want to make content eventually accessible to all the players, you should maintain a degree of integrity for the players actually trying to do the content to the best of their ability, the players who are looking to celebrate when they overcome challenges with their friends, the players who even if they aren’t as good as the Paragon’s and the Premonition’s want to overcome the challenges of the games in earnest, the players who continue to play the game because there is a bar set, that is high enough, but achievable enough, that they have a goal, a standard to aim for, a certain level of expertise and skill to acquire.

You made content accessible by making two difficulty settings, by providing people with the ability to attain the same rewards in different raid sizes, and yet you are still damaging and undermining the players who play for a challenge, by nerfing their content early and unnecessarily. You have done your part in making the raid game accessible. But by making it “easy” when it need not be (since you already have Normal modes), you are removing a massive incentive for a larger group of players. Players who only play a video game for its inherent challenge to them.

Solutions

What would I propose as a solution? The following:

Make nerfs consistent with a timeline.

About one month prior to the release of the next patch is when players should get the largest nerfs to any content. Even then, these nerfs should take into account that the biggest goal is to make sure the largest denominator can go from Normal Mode to Normal Mode. If Heroic Mode players are forced to go to Normal Modes, this is not an issue. The point of Heroic Modes is that they are optional for all, mandatory for none.

Do not do blanket nerfs.

If you’re going to nerf encounters, have the nerfs tiered and consistent with regards to timing. This means that a 20% health nerf is the worst thing you can do. Actually take the time with your teams and get diagnostic data on what stumps people the most on fights. Nerf the fights by adjusting details, like the damage of Ember Flare or the change to make Baleroc always Inferno Strike first.

Make the nerfs tiered.

Even as we near the end of the Tier cycle, instead of nerfing all 7 bosses on Heroic, it should be done with a few at a time, much like Ulduar. Nerf Shannox, Rhyolith, Beth’tilac. Then nerf Alysrazor and Baleroc and Domo. Then nerf Ragnaros.

Remember, at all times, that the thing that powers the engine of organized raiding, the creation and maintenance of the larger raiding community, is the top end of raiding.

I don’t mean the top 10 or 20 guilds. I mean the top 100, top 200 guilds. Your nerfs damage those guilds, your nerfs can demoralize those guilds. There’s a fine line between burning a guild out and keeping a guild running. Most of the time, burnout, however, stems from inadequate leadership, not overtuned content. But simply put, people are driven by their ability and interest to ascend. If people are allowed to reach the carrot on the stick, because the stick has been whittled down so low, then they will stop being interested in the carrot.

I could go on and on about all of this, but the point I’m trying to make is simple. You need to try and make the effort to do good by all of the players, but if you’re forced to choose, then choose the people who really attempt and pursue your content for all the right reasons, not all the wrong ones. You can’t go about catering to people who want loot, catering to people who aren’t willing to try harder and get better. I’m not saying that the need to play more than two nights a week, all I’m saying is that at most, all you are required to do is give people the ability to see Ragnaros, to see Deathwing. And that can be done with Normal Modes for those who can’t do harder content, or with 10 mans for those who can’t logistically find and field more players. Beyond this, by treading onto Heroic Mode ground, you take a huge risk by nerfing content for people who have little to no business trying those Heroic Modes. And if there are players on the fringe of this area, who would like to earnestly succeed at Heroic Modes, then you owe them the ability to try legitimately for as long as possible. They will never get better otherwise, nor will they ever feel satisfied if every time they try, they are handed nerfs to better handle the content.

Don’t nerf content to cater to the people who will dumb this game down. Nerf content to help prop up the people who will help to power the growth and stability of the community. Not the people who will flock to whatever gives them the best chance at having a higher ilvl.

- Ashunei of <Pie Chart>






23 Comments


  1. Back in Burning Crusade, I was in a decently ranked guild, and we were able to down Kil’jaeden before the massive nerfs that hit everything at the end of the expansion. I would have been pissed if we had been close to a kill and the encounter became trivial overnight. I fully understand the rage nerfs like this cause in top tier raiders. It’s not a matter of whether people should get to see content if they aren’t good enough, its that people shouldn’t be robbed of the satisfaction of downing *that boss* for the first time.

    However, finding myself somewhat stuck (friends, moving overseas, etc) in a guild practically incapable of raiding due to a significant lack of skilled players, I’ve been pugging firelands since early on in the tier, and have only been able to get 5/7 down. I can see the benefits of nerfs to the normal mode content. I don’t see it as necessary, because its really not that hard if people actually take the time to learn their class properly (Just the other day, a hunter in my guild managed to do 6k DPS on Cho’gall), but it helps people see content. I think Blizzard’s intention with the timeline was to allow people to jump right in to T13 when 4.3 launches, as opposed to spending time gearing up in the previous tier.

    The extent of the nerfs, and the fact that they’re also applying nerfs to heroic modes are things I completely disagree with. T11N became a joke after the 20% drop in health/damage. There were no more encounters that relied on each individual player’s skill to bypass. Good tanks could mitigate encounter mechanics, good dps could blow through a boss in a couple minutes, and good healers could carry bad players through standing in fire. Because of this, making the jump from T11N to T11H is huge, and T11N to T12N is almost as big. There exists such a huge gap that it becomes hard to use the previous tier to teach people how to properly raid before bringing them in on the current tier.


  2. Lardmus

    I’d like to give your GL a hug. Although I’m not in a top200 guild I can still feel for the pain your GL is describing. Last night after 6 hours of wiping our guild finally downed HC bethilac. The joy and excitement on TS was astounding. It took about 10 seconds for someone to say “I’m so happy we killed the bitch before the nerf”. I couldn’t agree more even if my spot was given to a holy pala due to…well… some well known reasons… Still, I feel happy for the players. I suppose it’s my turn to show what I’m made from on Sunday when it’s time for HC Baleroc.

    Anyway, I’m all for nerfs, but not when their point is to make end game content farmable to the most unskilled, unorganized pugs that have ever dwelled in Azeroth. If content is too hard then it should be nerfed. If content seems too hard then it should be re-evaluated, both by players and developers. Overcoming obstacles, that’s all this game’s raiding is about.


  3. Miz

    I can only agree with your GL, even if my perspective is very different from yours. My guild is only 1/7h, we haven’t really tried hard yet, we’ve suffered much the “summer curse”, we still make huge and dumb mistakes at Ragnaros normal (25). I don’t think that we deserve to kill heroic bosses, not yet: we need to step up, we need to put ourselves together and play better, because I know that we CAN play better. But, the incoming heroic nerf will completly kill this kind of progression. Yes, we will kill more bosses. Yes, our e-peen on WoW Progress will be a little bigger. But we wont step up, we wont put more effort in what we do, we wont stop making huge and dumb mistakes and when the next raiding tier will go live, we’ll fail like idiots. Nerfing the content right now, it’s like giving a cookie to a whining child: he doesnt deserve it, but you want him to stop crying.

    I also agree about the fact that heroic content was never intended to be accessible by everyone: it was the “niche” for the hardcore raiders, the good players, those that put effort in the game. I think that Blizzard, and somehow also a big part of the community, has forgot this.


  4. Stoove

    My guild is only just starting Rag normal and even we don’t want these nerfs! We were genuinely excited that we might end up doing some hardmodes this tier and gain that extra feeling of excitement knowing that you’re attempting some of the hardest content in game… and now we won’t be doing the hardest content in game any more.

    Completely. Gutted.


  5. What happened when Firelands came and a lot of Guilds were able to get the 7 bosses down to start HM’s we got hit by what we thought was HardMode but what it actually means. Like a child who figured out to take a chair so he could reach the cookie-jar but found itself looking for a ladder he couldn’t find the 1st time, we ran crying to our mother to put the jar where it belongs.

    I feel sad that we can so easily get if we just keep asking for it not knowing what it could eventually do for the game itself. By now I’ve read a lot of forums about this announced nerfing and found this one describing best what’s wrong with it and how easily it is to do otherwise.

    I hope with all my heart the upcoming nerfs scale with the time left for the patch to come otherwise I fear this will tip the scale for some of our finest players to the wrong side.
    Shagathal´s last post ..Re: PvP Application: Main, Darizzla=rouge. Alt Clinteast = dudu , rouge, druid, 85


  6. Im with you on this , on our server , frostmane EU , a releatively progressed eu server , we managed to kill HC Ryolith last raid , placing us joint 8th horde side ….
    ( 32nd overall MASSIVE imbalace horde-alliance ) to say that quilds like us , who i would assume are the some of the main body of raiding guilds ,

    “the causualcore ,with less raiding days but not less focus ”

    To quote Shannox ….. The pain… Lord of fire, it hurts…


  7. Cabòóse

    I’m disheartened… severely. I haven’t been playing WoW for very long, but I come from playing FFXI for 6-7 years in an end-game content environment, so I already have that raiding mindset – I want the best gear, I want the hardest kills, etc. When Cataclysm was released, I pressed hard to get raid kills on normal mode to prepare for heroic mode. By the time I finished normal mode content, they nerfed heroic mode in preparations for Firelands. Now, that I’m 6/7 in Firelands and possibly starting farm mode on the bosses before Ragnaros, I’ve got the mind set that, “Hey, soon we can attempt a heroic!” I guess that isn’t the case, they’re nerfing it AGAIN right before I get a chance to start heroic mode.

    Sure, a kill is a kill, regardless of difficulty. But, you said it best, there is no satisfaction from the kill – it’s just another kill, another night – which, I can see bringing up feelings of “Oh boy, this feels like a job, not something fun that we can work towards.”


  8. Percy

    I really hope someone brings up this kind of thing at Blizzcon. The nerfs and general wussification of the end-game in the name of “accessibility” are really getting out of hand these past few years.


  9. I wish i could post on the US Forums. It’s a really well written post and I would love to show my support.
    I even feel the need to expand the scope as the damage done does not stop within the top 200 guilds but runs even deeper. In 25man mode we’re at 3/7HC and hope to kill Alysrazor this week pre-nerf. It would be a huge letdown if we shouldn’t manage but even if we do, I’m kinda bumped by the thought of doing nerfed content by next week.
    First and foremost because – of course – the sense of accomplishment will be taken away which plays a huge role in motivation. But secondly I’m afraid that we will come up to 6/7 to quick and face a brickwall at rag, because he is clearly out of reach for us. I would argue that we are good enough to do 6/7 without the nerfs, it just takes more time as we only raid 3 nights per week. On top of that the firelands patch was released in the middle of summer so we had to cancel a few raids due to members being on vaccation or just enjoying a BBQ or whatever. So as it stands now we would have enough content to bang our heads against until the deathwing raid is released. With the nerfs however this likely won’t be the case.
    So in conclusion even a guild which barely made it into the top 1000 is genuinely affeceted by this and not in a positive way.

    I’m just not sure what to think of it. Usually I’m always able to see both sides of an arguement but this time around I don’t even understand where Blizzard is trying to go with this.

    —–
    As this was my first post on this site even though I follow it since the launch of cataclysm I really have to tip my hat to you Vixsin. It’s always a great read, no exeptions and I’m always looking foreward to the next. Keep up the good work, great thoughts and thorough analysis!
    Cires´s last post ..Firelands Hc 25er


  10. I completely agree with your points. Eventhough I don’t mind nerfing per se, I don’t like the lazy ass nerfing they’re throwing at us now. Going boss by boss and tweaking details instead of just basically chopping each boss’ head off with 20% health reduction is what they should do. Why do Blizzard think these kind of nerfs are a good idea? It only gives us the impression that they can’t be bothered anymore.
    Zinn´s last post ..Old Darkmoon Cards


  11. Tidewind

    I’m on Runetotem EU and I play with a guild that at best can grab 2 25s a week and then has to finish off Rag in a 10.

    We’re not BAD players, but I have no shame in admitting that because of disparity in drive we haven’t got a Heroic mode killed. Even from the little guy like me I give major props to this post.

    I personally don’t want to be handed heroic mode kills, mainly because I don’t want to feel as though the raiding environment is being watered down. But also because if there are nerfs coming at the end of the content it makes me feel as though the effort I did and do put in gets undermined and so lessens my drive to do better next tier to get through the normal modes QUICKER to spend more time on heroic modes. My god, if the rate of nerfs keeps increaseing and coming we’ll be getting Heroic loot from level 10 quests


  12. Great points. I think it’s a growing trend in mmorpg’s right now to “dumb down” the content in an effort to appeal to as many people as possible, because the standard business model says “more people = more money”, but I agree with you that what they’re not taking into account entirely is that if they turn off the high-end of the spectrum from chasing the carrot that will trickle down to the lower end of the spectrum until eventually nobody wants the carrot anymore. I agree with you that culturally it’s the high end of the raiding spectrum that drives the entire engine — the vast majority of the spectrum strives to achieve what only the privileged few can, and every tiny step along the way makes them feel they’ve accomplished something. I’m in that vast majority, and while my guild has yet to progress into heroics, I’m not happy that they’ve nerfed them because now I feel like once we DO venture into heroics (which is about a week away for us) it’s not going to feel like we’ve really accomplished something – the victory will feel cheaper and more hollow.

    That said, I think we should all bear in mind that Firelands is NOT the primary raid challenge of the Cataclysm expansion. Really, Firelands is little more than mid-expansion busywork along the path to Deathwing. I’m interpreting the obviously premature blanket nerfs as a sign from Blizzard that they want as many people as well geared as possible going into the real piece-de-resistance of Cataclysm, 4.3. And in that respect, I’m looking forward to T12 heroic gearing as quickly as possible so I’m well prepared to kick Deathwing’s ass pronto!


  13. Firestyle

    Devil’s advocate here.

    As a game designer, how do you manage the amount of time it takes a casual hardmode guild to down hardmode content, with the amount of time that casuals consume easy 5 mans and nerfed prior tier content?

    It’s just not working.


  14. In reply to firestyle, the answer is you don’t.

    Your question suggests that heroic modes are a normal point of progression for “casuals.” I would say that is misguided. Casuals, or rather, people who are consuming 5 mans and prior tiers shouldn’t set their sights on current heroic tiers. Rather, if they’ve “completed” the nerfed, prior tier, and current 5 mans, the next step is current normal-mode raids. I haven’t really seen anyone complain about nerfing that content (though there are some).

    If you haven’t defeated normal mode ragnaros yet, but were close (i.e. 6/7 normal modes) then it can be slightly frustrating, but normal progression is generally much more accelerated at this point, so you can’t be too upset at current nerfs. (though why they’re nerfing now and not when releasing 4.3 is weird).

    I have never completed a heroic mode at current tier in the 6 years I’ve been playing wow. I raid to play with 10-25-40 of my online friends to complete certain challenges, and the added stress of heroic modes usually just breaks down that comradere for no other reason than ilevels. And while that’s my personal opinion, I don’t think they should EVER nerf heroics. There’s no reason to: you add the extra stuff as a challenge and reward those that conquer that challenge with extra rewards. You should not give into people who want those specific rewards without putting in the extra effort, as was said before.

    There are many analogies that could be made, but the bottom line is that not everyone needs access to ALL of the content. You can compelte firelands fine in normal mode. Heroics need to mean something, and not just for the hardcore guilds that can defeat the content within a certain time frame. What ever happened to content nerfing itself with time and ilevels?

    No one is crying about Sinestra not being nerfed.


  15. Thromean

    As one of the “casuals” that had been stuck at 3/7 normal, i was (repeat was) looking forward to the nerfs. However the severity of them was way way too much. Normally we’d farm Shannox, then work on Beth and Rhyo as they still were not farm. Last night. first time in after the nerfs… 2 hours and 4/7 later with no wipes, I feel a little disquieted. We killed Baelroc in 1 shot with no one having seen the fight before except for our raid lead. I would have much preferred a stacking ICC type buff as this would have been a step stone to get over a wall rather than bulldozing down the wall. Hopfeully tonight will bring some more challenges with Staghelm and Fireturkey.


  16. Pomma

    This sums it all up right here and could not have been stated any better:

    ====
    But simply put, people are driven by their ability and interest to ascend. If people are allowed to reach the carrot on the stick, because the stick has been whittled down so low, then they will stop being interested in the carrot.
    ===

    Thanks again for the wonderful blog.


  17. I have to say that I’m disappointed in the nerfs (as many others are too). I feel like I now have add qualifiers when listing my progression (e.g., Resto Shaman 5/7 Heroic Pre-nerf).

    When doing Alyrazor, Beth’tilac, and Majordomo this week, the impression was “wow…really?” (Mostly disappointed with how easy Alys was). And to only spend 5 raid hours on H Baleroc was a bit anticlimactic.

    I think the part in your post that drives home the most is the portion on “blanket nerfs.” That’s just lazy, imo. If nerfs are warranted in ANY measure, nerf the specific mechanic by a specific amount.

    bleh. We’ll see….maybe we get H Rag in 50 attempts. >.>
    Nastiest´s last post ..Offspec Proficiency


  18. I wish i could post on the US Forums. It’s a really well written post and I would love to show my support.
    I even feel the need to expand the scope as the damage done does not stop within the top 200 guilds but runs even deeper. In 25man mode we’re at 3/7HC and hope to kill Alysrazor this week pre-nerf. It would be a huge letdown if we shouldn’t manage but even if we do, I’m kinda bumped by the thought of doing nerfed content by next week.
    First and foremost because – of course – the sense of accomplishment will be taken away which plays a huge role in motivation. But secondly I’m afraid that we will come up to 6/7 to quick and face a brickwall at rag, because he is clearly out of reach for us. I would argue that we are good enough to do 6/7 without the nerfs, it just takes more time as we only raid 3 nights per week. On top of that the firelands patch was released in the middle of summer so we had to cancel a few raids due to members being on vaccation or just enjoying a BBQ or whatever. So as it stands now we would have enough content to bang our heads against until the deathwing raid is released. With the nerfs however this likely won’t be the case.
    So in conclusion even a guild which barely made it into the top 1000 is genuinely affeceted by this and not in a positive way.

    +1


  19. Nerfs definatly were maybe overdone and soon. My 10 man was 1/7 Heroic and this week in 2 raid nights (4h each) we’re now 5/7 (missing rag and alys).


  20. shammypie

    i think you might have the wrong outlook on this.
    First: Let’s put it out there, nerfs to normal mode to help out casual players are inevitable in order for for 1 million+ people not in a top 20 guild (server not world) to get stuff down or they will eventually rage quit and blizzard won’t get money anymore.

    Second: Raiding guilds are not as bipolar as people make them out to be.
    What i mean is that raiding guilds have all levels of skill in completing raids from the guys who are just happy to get the farm bosses down smoothly in normal mode to the super powerful paragon. ALONG THE WAY are guilds that fall in the middle where they can only partially complete a difficulty level no matter how hard they try, be it normal or heroic. these guilds greatly outnumber the elites and the scrubs and need some kind of nerf in order to progress.

    Third: There will always be dates and insane achievements to distinguish the elite from everybody else. People who aren’t elite probably will not care and just be happy they got some stuff and had a fun experienced. People who are elite will be like dude you did it pre nerf awesome.

    Fourth: the nerfs are a lot more consistant than you make them out to be because blizzard monitors each week how many guilds are completing new fights and introduces nerfs when it becomes apparent players are stuck.
    a set period of time for nerfs will provide
    1. scheduled periods of canceled subscriptions
    2. badly timed nerfs to players who either thought they had more time or players sitting idle for a while
    3. less trust in blizzard itself

    In summary I think nerfs to heroics are a good thing and that you shouldn’t worry because its not like the top guilds are not going to notice if you are super bad or just plain bad. Berating blizzard for nerfing content will only earn scowls from the majority of players who actually need the nerfs. Finally it makes the game even more competitve because you will need to complete the content before everyone gets stuck which i think adds something extra for people who are/want to be elite


  21. Zargore

    I am no longer a high end raider myself, and even though I am glad to be able to see content, due to nerfs, this is not the way I want to see it.

    I agree with your GL in a timed nerf on normal modes 1-3 bosses a time, could be a good solutions, to us who isn’t in a active guild and who don’t have time to raid in the evenings, but there shouldn’t be any nerfs to HC mode. Theese encounters are meant as a challenge, and should stay that way.

    I have always loved to raid, and the challenges associated with it, but since the nerfings, which always comes before I have the time to play new content, I don’t have the same drive and excitement anymore.


  22. Aj

    Hi, I’m sorry if this sounds rude but have I missed something? It seems like your not posting anymore. Is it the end ;( ?



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